River Tees 2020

lowforcefly

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Not good, they do seem to be very ignorant towards anglers, not sure why they have that attitude. A 28g toby might change that 😂
I used to fish the big opens on the Ouse at York, which were regularly targeted by the 'Antis.'
One year the police had been tipped off, that the nutters were going try to cause an incident to get publicity?
We had a police inspector make an announcement at the draw, stating that if we retaliated in anyway, he would have to arrest us ?
You can't do anything !:(Even if they damage your gear, it's your word against theirs, and they always have a couple of 'Witnesses' handy !
 
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underbeing

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Well done! Good to hear of a few fish from the Tees.
I fished the Tees for 2 days, the N Tyne for 2 and the Tees for another 2. The Tees looked perfect but I never saw a fish. On the Tyne I saw one every half hour or so and caught a ST and lost a Salmon.

I know that doesn't mean that they're not there in the Tees but it's an interesting contrast none the less. I love the Tees and that's where I want to fish and will continue to do so.

The Tyne seems to be treated as a proper Salmon River like the great Scottish rivers, but I don't see any reason why the Tees doesn't deserve the same respect. Does the Tees have a hatchery program? Is it because the Tees crosses more county boundaries so less reason for each authority to invest?

Are there enough users of the damned up water to justify changing the whole ecosystem of the lower Tees? When flood prevention clearly can be done on demand like on the Thames.


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Grassy_Knollington

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I used to use Adams a bit, and one day turned up to find it shut ?
I don't know how Yarm AC are fairing at present, probably suffering like a lot of AC's, but it was a very big club.
When I fished my first open match there, I got a shock, not many clubs who had their own proper club house HQ... complete with a bar ?
Their big opens used to be sell out affairs!

I very rarely get down Stockton / The barrage, and just wonder how utilised the 'Slalom course' actually is ?
It must cost a bit to maintain, and I believe it is pumped to create different flows, which must be pricey to fire up ?

You can't blame people for coming up to use the upper river as it is stunning, especially at this time of year.
I don't, and I used to do a bit of canoeing in my younger days until I worked out I was too top heavy, and you weren't supposed to spend most of your time upside down ?:unsure::unsure:
Though, we get a couple of outfits running training sessions at Low Force on a regular basis, with up to 20 at a time, which can be a pain ?
I had the same experience with Adams. I moved away for work, came back to visit some mates and it had shut. Used to love going in there, trying to get info on Salmon catches was like getting blood out of a stone😂. Buy a pack of B175s and some dubbing, then spend an hour browsing at the ‘Rambo III’ fighting knife and air rifles. Good times.

No problems with anyone else using the river as long as they are willing to compromise, respect others and clean up when they leave. Sadly that doesn’t always happen. What does grip me a bit is the sense of entitlement to access and use someone else’s land without permission. Would these people be happy if I tipped up and started to cast in their pond, or walked through their garden to get where I needed?

Always liked the look of that Yarm clubhouse. Never coarse fished but had some good chub on fly out of Sockburn.
 

Grassy_Knollington

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I fished the Tees for 2 days, the N Tyne for 2 and the Tees for another 2. The Tees looked perfect but I never saw a fish. On the Tyne I saw one every half hour or so and caught a ST and lost a Salmon.

I know that doesn't mean that they're not there in the Tees but it's an interesting contrast none the less. I love the Tees and that's where I want to fish and will continue to do so.

The Tyne seems to be treated as a proper Salmon River like the great Scottish rivers, but I don't see any reason why the Tees doesn't deserve the same respect. Does the Tees have a hatchery program? Is it because the Tees crosses more county boundaries so less reason for each authority to invest?

Are there enough users of the damned up water to justify changing the whole ecosystem of the lower Tees? When flood prevention clearly can be done on demand like on the Thames.


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If you build it, they will come......

I think the Tyne gets treated differently because it has a run and that was largely IMO the product of improvements in water quality.

The Tees gets far less attention because it hasn’t had a decent Salmon run since the 1930s and when there are catches, folk keep them close to their chest. If it were not for folk like Chris Gaines, Stivy and others, there wouldn’t even be the current amended barrage schedule.

Get a decent, consistent run going and maybe there will be more interest.
 

underbeing

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If you build it, they will come......

I think the Tyne gets treated differently because it has a run and that was largely IMO the product of improvements in water quality.

The Tees gets far less attention because it hasn’t had a decent Salmon run since the 1930s and when there are catches, folk keep them close to their chest. If it were not for folk like Chris Gaines, Stivy and others, there wouldn’t even be the current amended barrage schedule.

Get a decent, consistent run going and maybe there will be more interest.
What exactly do you mean by a run? I've seen days where salmon are running in decent numbers. Something a bit more predictable?

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cgaines10

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What exactly do you mean by a run? I've seen days where salmon are running in decent numbers. Something a bit more predictable?

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The run that GK is eluding to is the whole run over the course of a season, not to be confused with running fish. On the Tees we have a couple of issues which points to us having a poor run.

1. The Barrage counter is the only data we have along the stretch of the Tees that counts migratory fish. We know that the majority of fish tend to run over the gates now so these go uncounted. The fish pass really is a joke, it goes against all of the rules for a fish pass to function properly at a dam.
2. Rod catch data, with so little effort from anglers on the Tees fishing for Salmon, it comes as no surprise these numbers would be low. There are thoughts within the community that there are fish that get caught and go uncounted. if true, this is just adding to the problems, but this could merely be hearsay.

I have been trying to get either a better counter at the Barrage to count the fish going over the gates or the next obstruction being broken Scar. Broken Scar has long been on the EAs list to improve fish passage and change it to an all fish - fish pass. Which is to include a counter. This has been rejected time after time and will cost circa 400k.

When the new pass went in at Barnard castle, there was supposed to be a new counter included. Everything was made to house the cameras/counters. All the kit was ready to be installed but the copex was filled with sand/rocks I'm led to believe. As such this has been left since and no one seem to be bothered in trying to get this setup? I'm not even getting replies on the subject which is disappointing.

Counter data and rod effort go hand in hand, if anglers can see that there is more fish due to higher numbers counted then more anglers will fish. Maybe that's their motive - to continue to hinder us 🤷‍♂️

The Tyne is a different story. Kielder came at a time when fish passage was much more thought of than when we had all our dams built, as such they sought compensation (hatchery) & got it. Did it help? There's arguments for and against. When Kielder was built due to it's size, there was no need for the dams we have on the Tees catchment, but I haven't heard of the EA pushing for these to be removed and spawning grounds be returned?! 👀

Will the hatchery continue? There's a movement to have no salmon stocking, but there's a lot of money involved in the Tyne now & I don't think the EA have the cojones.
 

Mattytree

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A few things I’m thinking at the minute , with the additional stocking down to the Tyne tunnel finished it will be interesting to see how the south tynes runs develop as at the minute this season it does not look good...our north Tyne beat already is up on last year and there is a few weeks left.
Also the tees as well as the weir take water from the Tyne so is there a possibility that it increases straying fish from the Tyne due to river scent in these rivers.
also think the n Tyne hatchery is very different from the American style that does not work or is accused of not working.
 

teesfisher

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A few things I’m thinking at the minute , with the additional stocking down to the Tyne tunnel finished it will be interesting to see how the south tynes runs develop as at the minute this season it does not look good...our north Tyne beat already is up on last year and there is a few weeks left.
Also the tees as well as the weir take water from the Tyne so is there a possibility that it increases straying fish from the Tyne due to river scent in these rivers.
also think the n Tyne hatchery is very different from the American style that does not work or is accused of not working.
Whilst there is the facility to transfer water from the Tyne to the Tees via the pipe which comes in at Egglestone, it has in fact, only been used twice in the past 25+ years, and for a very limited time on each occasion.
The Tees was also stocked with just over 1,000,000 salmon fry and parr (all of Tyne origin and from Kielder hatchery) between 1990 and 1995, yet there is absolutely no evidence that these fish made any significant contribution to the recovery (which is still ongoing) of the Tees salmon stocks.
 

Grassy_Knollington

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What exactly do you mean by a run? I've seen days where salmon are running in decent numbers. Something a bit more predictable?

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I mean a consistent and, as you say, predictable run of fish over a few months of the season.

The kind of run that makes it worthwhile to fish more than one or two areas in good water.

The kind of run where anglers feel its worth travelling an hour or two to fish.

The kind of run which fills up the likes of Thornaby and Stockton AAs with Game members.

IMHO the Tees is following the pattern of many recovering rivers. There are relatively few fish per mile. They come in, show rarely, get their heads down, disperse across a long stretch of river and sit down to wait. Nobody thinks the fish are there so few folk fish for them. Towards the end of the season the fish congregate in the upper reaches when they become catchable again.

The consistent runs of fish just aren’t there to top up the lies throughout the river, to provide the running fish in ‘normal’ water conditions or to work up the residents and bring them on the take every time there is a wee rise.

Since the barrage there isn’t even the trickle of fish nosing in off the tide. These fish are the ones that might go back down to the salt, or they might run over the weir at low Middleton & up river for the early bird to catch at Sockburn or Hurworth or Gainford in a couple of days.

The Tyne took 30 years from Kielder to record catches in 2010. The Tees seems to be stuck in about 1983.

Hopefully the hard work that some have put in behind to change things but I don’t think change is just about more effort, we need more fish.

Once that happens, the pressure might really be on the EA, C&RT et al.
 

dave1959

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GK, the runs of fish in the Tees in 1983 were well greater (runs above the Barrage) compared to today. Also the river can not be compared to other recovering rivers in my opinion because the Barrage arrests the runs of fish. The main difference today compared to 1983 is that the fish run the river differently today than they did back then. I used to stand at Eston Jetty back in the 7O's when the river was in spate and watch the runs of fish going through. Big runs of fish too. Whilst people continue to believe the river was dead of migratory fish in the years gone by, i feel it helps the EA to sit on their hands and bleat about they saved the salmon stocks etc. A load of ******** really. Unless the Barrage is taken down, i cant see the river ever becoming like it once was, although good numbers still run the river and are worth trying for. I left the Tees for other rivers the last 8 years or so, but intend to get back on it, as id rather catch a Tees fish than a fish from any other river to be honest.
 

underbeing

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GK, the runs of fish in the Tees in 1983 were well greater (runs above the Barrage) compared to today. Also the river can not be compared to other recovering rivers in my opinion because the Barrage arrests the runs of fish. The main difference today compared to 1983 is that the fish run the river differently today than they did back then. I used to stand at Eston Jetty back in the 7O's when the river was in spate and watch the runs of fish going through. Big runs of fish too. Whilst people continue to believe the river was dead of migratory fish in the years gone by, i feel it helps the EA to sit on their hands and bleat about they saved the salmon stocks etc. A load of ******** really. Unless the Barrage is taken down, i cant see the river ever becoming like it once was, although good numbers still run the river and are worth trying for. I left the Tees for other rivers the last 8 years or so, but intend to get back on it, as id rather catch a Tees fish than a fish from any other river to be honest.
getting rid of the 'leisure' aspect of the barrage is the important bit? They could continue to use it as a flood defense as and when required.

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dave1959

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I cant see that ever happening mate, as the Barrage was built to get rid of the mud flats all the way to Yarm on Tees and above. And would you believe, to attract peoples attention to the Barrage area, rather than industry to the north east of it.
My late father used to cylcle with his mate to the middle Tees above Piercebridge in the 1940's to go camping. The river was clear then before they built Cow Green and used to tell me, they used to try and catch salmon laying in the pools by dropping rocks on them. He didnt catch any mind. I remember going out with him in his wagon and we stopped at Piercebridge in the 1960's and we looked over the bridge and see loads of chub and plenty of salmon/sea trout lying up in the pool below. That was before Cow Green too.
 

greenlaner2009

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I cant see that ever happening mate, as the Barrage was built to get rid of the mud flats all the way to Yarm on Tees and above. And would you believe, to attract peoples attention to the Barrage area, rather than industry to the north east of it.
My late father used to cylcle with his mate to the middle Tees above Piercebridge in the 1940's to go camping. The river was clear then before they built Cow Green and used to tell me, they used to try and catch salmon laying in the pools by dropping rocks on them. He didnt catch any mind. I remember going out with him in his wagon and we stopped at Piercebridge in the 1960's and we looked over the bridge and see loads of chub and plenty of salmon/sea trout lying up in the pool below. That was before Cow Green too.
How could Cow Green reservoir make the river not clear.
 

underbeing

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I cant see that ever happening mate, as the Barrage was built to get rid of the mud flats all the way to Yarm on Tees and above. And would you believe, to attract peoples attention to the Barrage area, rather than industry to the north east of it.
My late father used to cylcle with his mate to the middle Tees above Piercebridge in the 1940's to go camping. The river was clear then before they built Cow Green and used to tell me, they used to try and catch salmon laying in the pools by dropping rocks on them. He didnt catch any mind. I remember going out with him in his wagon and we stopped at Piercebridge in the 1960's and we looked over the bridge and see loads of chub and plenty of salmon/sea trout lying up in the pool below. That was before Cow Green too.
Times change. Mud flats are now seen as part of the natural environment / ecosystem / habitat.

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cgaines10

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Yes, returning as much of the river back to it's natural state is the goal. So removal of dams (Barrage) should be top of the list, shortly followed with the reservoirs that are affecting spawning tribs. This should be a goal seen as "when" & not "if". The five point salmon plan motto isn't worth the papers is written on if it's not backed up by actions.
 

cgaines10

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Fished the Tees on Thursday, river was still up but starting to drop at the time. Slightly coloured but the fly was fishing lovely. Had a pull off something but not I’ve no idea what it was. I’ll be out again this week.


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