Patagonia (the company) supports anti's!

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westie4566

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Right, many of us who enjoy our fishing also enjoy our other fieldsports including shooting.

I'll be straight up and say that I've shot twice in the past decade, but did shoot a fair bit in my youth. Still don't mind the odd day out though!

Imagine my anger this evening when I discovered that Patagonia have been actively giving financial support to a group of anti shooting radicals in the UK, the group 'Moorland Monitors'.


Might I suggest that anyone who fishes and shoots get's in contact with Patagonia to register their disgust at these double standards. ie, happy enough to take money of of fishers to actively fund a non 'charity' that tries to ban shooting. :mad:
 
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Andrew B

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Right, many of us who enjoy our fishing also enjoy our other fieldsports including shooting.

I'll be straight up and say that I've shot twice in the past decade, but did shoot a fair bit in my youth. Still don't mind the odd day out though!

Imagine my anger this evening when I discovered that Patagonia have been actively giving financial support to a group of anti shooting radicals in the UK, the group 'Moorland Monitors'.


Might I suggest that anyone who fishes and shoots get's in contact with Patagonia to register their disgust at these double standards. ie, happy enough to take money of of fishers to actively fund a non 'charity' that tries to ban shooting. :mad:
WTF Westie! We’re this not 2021 I’d seriously think it was a joke?
Hold your horse though😂 that said, were I to summarise their target audience and clients? I wouldn’t hesitate to say these places cater for the hot shot plastic surgeon couple who film their fishing exploits round the globe and live in some mega woke Democrat city where hypocrisy just comes with the territory right?
I don’t hunt or shoot as I’m a bit soft or squeamish but I’ve killed enough Salmon and Sea Trout that would immediately make me a hypocrite for judging anyone who hunts.

Since when did game fishing cease to be a hunt between man and fish?
How do they live with themselves when they have a bleeder and have to take it for the table?

And finally do these muppets not realise that in doing this, they’re helping take down their own sport from the inside?😳
 

Safranfoer

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That’s not Patagonia supporting antis though really, is it? It’s Patagonia supporting a charity where I live that is trying to stop driven grouse estates using illegal practices on their land. The estates that give antis all the ammunition they need. The estates that on other threads, many in the field sports community have agreed give the good estates a bad name and should be stopped. If you’re against Moorland Monitor, you’re for illegal land management. I can’t see anything on their site about banning shooting. They largely talk about the traps and stink pits in their socials, which they have evidence of and frequently share. Who IS allowed to police the estates...?
 
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mows

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That’s not Patagonia supporting antis though really, is it? It’s Patagonia supporting a charity where I live that is trying to stop driven grouse estates using illegal practices on their land. The estates that give antis all the ammunition they need. The estates that on other threads, many in the field sports community have agreed give the good estates a bad name and should be stopped. If you’re against Moorland Monitor, you’re for illegal land management b
That's correct in theory Saffy.
But our local one seems to have a few Cwiss extremist sheeples, who see crimes in everything.
They aren't against bad estates.
They are against all estates.
With no brain power to think of alternatives.
In principle, because Angus has\had some of the scummiest estates in Scotland, I like the idea of some of them being monitored, but not by this prejudiced bunch.
Once licencing comes in, it wouldn't surprise me if fabricated evidence starts appearing in a similar vein to some hunt SABs.
 

peterchilton

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I wouldn't buy their overpriced products at any money. Consider that if it wasn't for the Grouse estates there would be very few harriers and other birds of prey, would we then see patagonia and the moorland monitor managing the moors for grouse with no shooting?
Similar thing with packam and his corvids ....
 

Safranfoer

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That's correct in theory Saffy.
But our local one seems to have a few Cwiss extremist sheeples, who see crimes in everything.
They aren't against bad estates.
They are against all estates.
With no brain power to think of alternatives.
In principle, because Angus has\had some of the scummiest estates in Scotland, I like the idea of some of them being monitored, but not by this prejudiced bunch.
Once licencing comes in, it wouldn't surprise me if fabricated evidence starts appearing in a similar vein to some hunt SABs.
They only operate in the Peaks so while I agree they probably aren’t keen on all estates, their raison d’etre is to protect the wildlife in their backyard from illegal practices. And they don’t mention shooting ever, as far as I can tell. They’re probably smart in that regard - going after the crimes, not the principle. I follow them on Twitter and they share enough photos of piles of dead birds in a ditch and poisoned raptors for me to have little sympathy with the estate. If they don’t want to be monitored by a prejudiced bunch, they should stop committing crimes and leaving the evidence lying around. V surprised Derbyshire Police haven’t caught any dodgy types - but they only go after the walkers WEARING Patagonia, in fairness.

The community shouldn’t defend estates like Peak District if they want public support come any reckoning. They should be LOUDER than groups like Moorland Monitor in condemning them, not suggesting it’s the antis doing the crimes. ANTIFA!
 

Roag Fisher

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Right, many of us who enjoy our fishing also enjoy our other fieldsports including shooting.

I'll be straight up and say that I've shot twice in the past decade, but did shoot a fair bit in my youth. Still don't mind the odd day out though!

Imagine my anger this evening when I discovered that Patagonia have been actively giving financial support to a group of anti shooting radicals in the UK, the group 'Moorland Monitors'.


Might I suggest that anyone who fishes and shoots get's in contact with Patagonia to register their disgust at these double standards. ie, happy enough to take money of of fishers to actively fund a non 'charity' that tries to ban shooting. :mad:
Correct, and Corin and the S&TC are happy to have Patagonia meddling in their anti aquaculture crusade.
What happens when S&TC has to step up and push for licences to cull problem seals and FEBs?
 

Elibank

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That’s not Patagonia supporting antis though really, is it? It’s Patagonia supporting a charity where I live that is trying to stop driven grouse estates using illegal practices on their land. The estates that give antis all the ammunition they need. The estates that on other threads, many in the field sports community have agreed give the good estates a bad name and should be stopped. If you’re against Moorland Monitor, you’re for illegal land management. I can’t see anything on their site about banning shooting. They largely talk about the traps and stink pits in their socials, which they have evidence of and frequently share. Who IS allowed to police the estates...?
Looks like you and I are almost surrounded by the buggers...
 

Safranfoer

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Looks like you and I are almost surrounded by the buggers...
I’m quite convinced you live in the same town as me... you’d certainly have an informed view on moorland practices round here. What say you?
 

Troosers Too

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About Us​

Moorland Monitors are a network of volunteers getting out to monitor grouse shooting estates for crime and cruelty. The industry of driven grouse shooting relies on the destruction of wildlife and habitat, often including criminal acts such as illegal poisoning, trapping, snaring and land damage. All of these crimes have taken place in our national parks – areas which should be havens for wildlife. Moorland Monitors protect wildlife and habitat

Sorry, Saffy. I have to disagree with you. The above text is taken from their website. The bald truth is that most managed grouse moors have far greater biodiversity, populations of ground nesting birds and raptors than other mon-managed moors. Yes, in the past, moor keepers did some terrible things and certain rogue keepers do still do some stupid and illegal things but in today's world it just isn't in the owners interests to behave in this way any more. This persecution of the shoots is simply a continuation of the same old politics of envy - let's bash the toffs!

I'm all for upholding the law and for estates to be examined. Those that break those laws should be heavily punished but to suggest a group like Moorland Monitors don't have a, barely, hidden agenda and could ever be anything other than prejudiced, is laughable.
 

Safranfoer

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About Us​

Moorland Monitors are a network of volunteers getting out to monitor grouse shooting estates for crime and cruelty. The industry of driven grouse shooting relies on the destruction of wildlife and habitat, often including criminal acts such as illegal poisoning, trapping, snaring and land damage. All of these crimes have taken place in our national parks – areas which should be havens for wildlife. Moorland Monitors protect wildlife and habitat

Sorry, Saffy. I have to disagree with you. The above text is taken from their website. The bald truth is that most managed grouse moors have far greater biodiversity, populations of ground nesting birds and raptors than other mon-managed moors. Yes, in the past, moor keepers did some terrible things and certain rogue keepers do still do some stupid and illegal things but in today's world it just isn't in the owners interests to behave in this way any more. This persecution of the shoots is simply a continuation of the same old politics of envy - let's bash the toffs!

I'm all for upholding the law and for estates to be examined. Those that break those laws should be heavily punished but to suggest a group like Moorland Monitors don't have a, barely, hidden agenda and could ever be anything other than prejudiced, is laughable.
Fair enough. You could argue they've reached that view because of the practices in their back yard - but fair enough.

It'd be a bold move from the community to fund their work into weeding out the bad apples. I know they never would - but... It would evidence confidence and conviction and determination.
 

bankwheel

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Most of these sabs/monitors are now just rent a mob thugs.
And Patagonia is helping to fund their illegal activities.
Too many assumptions there and Patagonia are not funding illegal activities, how can you justify that statement?
 

Roag Fisher

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Too many assumptions there and Patagonia are not funding illegal activities, how can you justify that statement?
I am in a lot of game keeping groups where various things get posted and shared.
Even trespassing on someone`s land, either on foot or in a vehicle, masked up, is an illegal activity.
Without even touching on intimidation and harassment.
I believe that a sneep MSP has recently voiced his concern about the level of harassment being directed against rural land workers by "monitor" types. England/Scotland, no matter. It is going on everywhere.
 

Safranfoer

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I am in a lot of game keeping groups where various things get posted and shared.
Even trespassing on someone`s land, either on foot or in a vehicle, masked up, is an illegal activity.
Without even touching on intimidation and harassment.
I believe that a sneep MSP has recently voiced his concern about the level of harassment being directed against rural land workers by "monitor" types. England/Scotland, no matter. It is going on everywhere.
That's really not cool. Is there any neutral external monitoring body? Any schemes and standards that decent estates can sign up to, like the Red Tractor farm assurance...? Would take a LOT of wind out of sails if the 95% of land owners were transparent.
 

Safranfoer

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True. Mr Trump's supporters would also argue that he was robbed of his election win because of voting fraud. They are prejudiced extremists too.
There's evidence of wildlife crime though - not quite the same analogy. A better example is the people that were prejudiced against Trump from day one and leaped on every single thing he ever said or did, because he was a sleazy lying crooked businessman. If he hadn't been, they'd have less ammunition.
 

bankwheel

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I am in a lot of game keeping groups where various things get posted and shared.
Even trespassing on someone`s land, either on foot or in a vehicle, masked up, is an illegal activity.
Without even touching on intimidation and harassment.
I believe that a sneep MSP has recently voiced his concern about the level of harassment being directed against rural land workers by "monitor" types. England/Scotland, no matter. It is going on everywhere.
So you haven’t answered the question, what illegal activity is MM involved in?
 

Roag Fisher

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I will have trawl later. I do a fair bit of bailiff work. We know what goes on. But gathering evidence, catching punters, let alone proving anything is incredibly difficult. Getting a case together against "monitors" is no different.
Quite frankly, I am astonished any angler is naive enough to be taken in by any of thoe activists, who are no friends of any country sport.
 

Troosers Too

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There's evidence of wildlife crime though - not quite the same analogy. A better example is the people that were prejudiced against Trump from day one and leaped on every single thing he ever said or did, because he was a sleazy lying crooked businessman. If he hadn't been, they'd have less ammunition.
Nice one Saffy. You're trying to turn this one round on me. I'm saying that MM are not an unbiased or prejudiced group. You said that they were made that way by current practices. I replied by saying that you sounded like the Trump diehards.

I'm not trying to defend Trump or criminal activities by keepers.

I wouldn't trust MM to collect evidence of illegal activity any more than I'd trust on of Trump's supporters to provide "evidence" of voting fraud.
 
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