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Grassy_Knollington

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”The over dependence on salmon catches as a figure that influences a beats popularity and it’s market value means that Proprietors and Ghillies are constantly under pressure to maintain catch numbers. This focus may be inhibiting diversification of river usage, pursuit of alternative fishing experiences, entrepreneurship and an appetite to widen the target audience.”

Luxury Wild Swimming experiences on the Tay anyone? Watch out for Vision 110s

:lol:

The bit about wider stakeholder engagement is useful but overall; I cannot believe somebody paid for ‘Dunco’ (Prop Duncan Forbes?), to write this.

Rod licenses “may provide a useful marketing and information channel”. . Well quite Dunco, I lose count of the number of ‘new audiences’ the EA have reached through the ‘channel’ of licence holders’ emails.......

The Dee is a model :wow:
 

Wee-Eck

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I read the first line of the presentation. That was enough for me.

'Our rivers have never been cleaner or better managed. '
 

heather point

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This has opened up a very large can of worms.
The paragraph about encouraging people to have lower expectations particularly amused me. I think that anyone coming to salmon fishing within the last 20 years has had to have lower expectations and how the author of the report thinks that people will be encouraged to spend thousands of pounds on equipment, travelling, accommodation, permits etc when there are no fish in the rivers is laughable.
As for the expectation that 10 salmon in a lifetime is a reasonable expectation, well, words fail me.
I could go on and on but the root of the problem is lack of salmon and until our so called Scottish Government remove the blinkers from their eyes and forget about Independence and get on with running the country, a job which they seem to be ill qualified to do,there will be no improvement.
We are just sliding over the cliff.
 

mows

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What a load of tripe.

Allow me to charge you a fee sir so that I can pick the colour of paper to wrap your turd in and sell it back to you for a much higher price and richer smell..

Its a bit like selling golfing holidays but you can only play one or 2 holes on each course.

Some mention of not banning spinning. No mention of bait.

I don't know who did this, but I doubt their a salmon fisher.

Its nowhere near April.
 

Roag Fisher

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What a load of tripe.

Allow me to charge you a fee sir so that I can pick the colour of paper to wrap your turd in and sell it back to you for a much higher price and richer smell..

Its a bit like selling golfing holidays but you can only play one or 2 holes on each course.

Some mention of not banning spinning. No mention of bait.

I don't know who did this, but I doubt their a salmon fisher.

Its nowhere near April.
I know this document was discussed by FMS at their agm (I think). It would be interesting to see the minutes.
 

Jockiescott

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As someone who's mindset changed from "catching to fishing" a long time ago, that document is up there with the most depressing things I've ever had the misfortune to read.

Almost everything it proposes is everything that I feel is already "wrong" about modern day salmon fishing.

That document left me feeling rather hollow and feeling for the anglers of Scotland.
 

MCXFisher

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Do we know whether any Forum members attended the focus groups or responded to the surveys?

Looking at the survey responses at the back of the document suggests a rather sterile and bleak exercise.
 

JoeE

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Who on earth is Mr Duncan Forbes been talking to or even smoking. Utter clown and this goes to Scottish enterprise.

Comical at best.
 

ArchieL

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At first when i read through this i was shocked and then i let it sink in and realize that we as salmon anglers are being treated for fools. Emperors new clothes springs to mind. In a nutshell they do not want proper salmon anglers on rivers as they expect to catch salmon when they go salmon fishing, they want tourists who will enjoy themselves surrounded in nature and just being out in the fresh air talking about anything "BUT" the lack of fish with their now brainwashed Ghillie. Any new person coming into salmon angling has to set their lives target at 10 salmon for their lifetime spent chasing the mighty salmon.

The scary thing is that the people who are responsible for this utter guff are running a kiddy on Parliament but want to gain independence from the UK and run a country for real !!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOW JUST WOW.
 

keirstream

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Response To Survey

In common with most on here, I am astonished that someone actually paid to commission this survey.
Here are some responses similar to those received.

 

Nigel Passmore

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Do we know whether any Forum members attended the focus groups or responded to the surveys?

Looking at the survey responses at the back of the document suggests a rather sterile and bleak exercise.
Agreed. It would have been useful to understand what the scope and remit of the report was. It appears (apologies if this is wrong) to be written by someone who doesn't fish for salmon and has been asked to take a standard business development plan approach and apply it to salmon fishing in order to attract new 'customers' to dabble more often - expand the market as it were.

There is nothing wrong with that per se. Much of what is suggested is straight from the Playbook of how you'd approach the commercial development of any leisure based activity. However, as has been stated elsewhere, the biggest elephant in the room (among many in taking this leisure industry approach to salmon fishing in Scotland) is if we don't increase the runs of salmon there will be no basic salmon fishing infrastructure to attract 'customers' to dabble in the first place. No ghillies, no guides, no lavish huts (well almost none) and more likelyhood of seeing the Loch Ness Monster than catching a salmon is an unsustainable platform. Near me, Bookham Common used to be famous for its Nightingales. People came from all over the UK to see them. Now they have all but gone, and so have the twitchers; no end-to-end experience will bring them back only Nightingales.

I think the easiest way to explain it to Mr Forbes might be to take his example of the North Coast 500 and say from next year petrol and diesel vehicles will not be allowed by tourists to follow the route and see how that works out - actually the way it is expanding out of control on an infrastructure that can't cope maybe that would be a good thing....

Regards

NHP
 
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Jockiescott

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At first when i read through this i was shocked and then i let it sink in and realize that we as salmon anglers are being treated for fools. Emperors new clothes springs to mind. In a nutshell they do not want proper salmon anglers on rivers as they expect to catch salmon when they go salmon fishing, they want tourists who will enjoy themselves surrounded in nature and just being out in the fresh air talking about anything "BUT" the lack of fish with their now brainwashed Ghillie. Any new person coming into salmon angling has to set their lives target at 10 salmon for their lifetime spent chasing the mighty salmon.

The scary thing is that the people who are responsible for this utter guff are running a kiddy on Parliament but want to gain independence from the UK and run a country for real !!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOW JUST WOW.
Unfortunately ArchieL, your post brings many anglers I meet on my river to mind. They're as happy as a pig in sh1t to spend thousands on the latest gear with absolutely no idea of how to use it or any notion of river craft.

They're in their element standing chest deep in pools, that really don't need waded at all, casting lines as far as they can and are in complete shock if a salmon should take their fly.

It is these people that the report seems to be based around. Perhaps it was these type of people who took the time to fill out the consultation documents.

Using these types of anglers to base catch statistics on is more than flawed. Some of these anglers would be more than lucky to catch 10 in their lifetime alright.
 

Gustav

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The stuff in the report is not all bad but it is written in a "lashings of ginger beer" style and fails to discuss in depth the real reason for a long term and possibly irreversible decline in salmon runs.
It almost ignores the basic fact why people pay to fish.
Its catching fish or at least seeing them.
If there are no fish to catch then it will be hard to sell permits or "experiences".
Just look at the available rods on the Tweed this week.

I see the report was done for Scottish Enterprise.

Their money would have been better spent on research into smolt mortality.
 

FaughanPurple

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This is an actual report?

I thought it was student case-study and stopped reading after a page or 2…

Agree with the target audience assessment, all the gear and no idea! some only know to be annoyed because they’re told to be but now know all the answers to everything.
 

allysshrimp

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I can't ever recall reading so much SH.TE
There are a lot of people on here that could have produced a better document, addressing the real issues.
 
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cgaines10

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Wow, that's embarrassing. Basically trying to flog days casting to just enjoy the scenery and if you're that lucky angler to get a fish well done you. No suggest of lowering prices due to lack of fish though :doh:
 

tony considine

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The worry here is the fact that there are people who don't think the future of salmon fishing involves anglers. Yes, there are tourists willing to 'have a go', and possibly have the money to do so, but it's sad to think that our great tradition and heritage could be reduced to this.
t.c.
 

Isisalar

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So, there's very few Salmon left, come and spend loads of money and enjoy not catching any.

Anything mentioning stakeholders, partners and outreaching is guaranteed to have been written by a politically correct moron.
 
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