Covid Vaccine... Well would you ??

D

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I’m sure there will be millions of poorer disadvantage countries queueing up to take it. Assuming they can afford to do so.

I do hope these companies making or will be making Billions from their vaccine, share the vaccine with those whom can’t afford to get it.

The Oxford vaccine will be sold to developing countries at cost price
 

Andrew B

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Because flu is much less contagious than covid, so the measures in place to control covid are keeping a lid on the flu. The tests for flu and covid are very different, btw. Flu deaths aren't being absorbed in covid numbers.
Ah ok I did wonder about this? There must be a government thing going on with flu jabs since my surgery rung me up days ago to offer me the jab which ordinarily I’d have to pay for.
I do remember a few years ago when the hospitals were overflowing with patients with a bad strain of flu. Made the news because of folk being forced to sleep in makeshift beds ect.
 

Andrew B

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It should be noted though that our typical flu season is December to March, so we haven't really got there again yet.
Yep absolutely. I got it last year and the year before in January and both times it absolutely flattened me for a month.
 

happy days

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Perhaps more like a John Gummer moment:

'At a boat show in the East of England, he fed his daughter Cordelia a British beef burger for the gathered press and cameras. Six years later a link between BSE and a human form of the disease was officially confirmed in the Commons. By then an EU ban on British beef was already in force'.

View attachment 52976

Ah Gummer another spitting image puppet earned plenty from the public purse, still earning even now I think, didn’t he burn his kids mouth with the burger it was that hot.
 

Walleye

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I think that’s very wise and yes just like so much of this year not much of it makes sense?
I’ll give you just one anomaly. We all know how bad seasonal flu is, and how many people it kills every year? Make no mistake influenza is a killer.
With this in mind can anyone answer why as soon as Covid turns up, flu deaths have just vanished off the face of the earth?
Before Covid, the only mitigation against flu was the annual flu vaccine. After Covid, the flu had to deal with its own vaccine, masks, social distancing, improved hygiene etc etc...

After the Covid vaccine is available and administered to a decent chunk of the population, Covid will also need to deal with all of the above and will vanish just as quickly as flu did this year. It sounds like the Covid vaccines are far more effective than the flu virus, mainly because each year the flu strain vaccinated against is an educated guess whereas these covid vaccines have been developed to vaccinate against specific and well known (by now) strain of corona virus.

Of course, we will pretty much get back to being filthy humans as quickly as possible. So Covid will probably be managed just like flu in future years without lockdowns and without any restrictions on personal freedoms.
 

Andrew B

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Before Covid, the only mitigation against flu was the annual flu vaccine. After Covid, the flu had to deal with its own vaccine, masks, social distancing, improved hygiene etc etc...

After the Covid vaccine is available and administered to a decent chunk of the population, Covid will also need to deal with all of the above and will vanish just as quickly as flu did this year. It sounds like the Covid vaccines are far more effective than the flu virus, mainly because each year the flu strain vaccinated against is an educated guess whereas these covid vaccines have been developed to vaccinate against specific and well known (by now) strain of corona virus.

Of course, we will pretty much get back to being filthy humans as quickly as possible. So Covid will probably be managed just like flu in future years without lockdowns and without any restrictions on personal freedoms.
Lol that’s so funny about going back to being filthy humans again? Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t remember so many folk going out drinking and pouring out into the streets and hugging everyone in sight? What’s that all about, it’s as if being locked down for a few months made these people insane?
The only people I’ve known who have had the Covid are my neighbors and the husband caught it on a night out with his mates in Skipton and then passed it to his wife.
Everyone I know who’s been sensible has been fine. Ive never been a touchy, feely type person anyway and can’t be doing with folk invading my personal space.
 

salarchaser

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It sounded like the suggestion was that this is different from every other vaccine in that one would still have the infection for the ‘normal’ duration. As I said, I’d like to see the evidence of this, otherwise I think we can assume that it will be the same as every other vaccine and you’ll have no/few symptoms and kill off the infection very rapidly, which of course hugely reduces the likelihood of transmission (assuming one can even transmit the virus in its early stages)
Just heard another interviewee (medical correspondent) similarly saying that the vaccine will reduce symptoms but it is not known if it will inhibit transmission. This is still under investigation.
So, after vaccination, the inference is that you could still get the virus and be an asymptomatic spreader.
 
D

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Just heard another interviewee (medical correspondent) similarly saying that the vaccine will reduce symptoms but it is not known if it will inhibit transmission. This is still under investigation.
So, after vaccination, the inference is that you could still get the virus and be an asymptomatic spreader.

I guess the question about infected time being reduced still stands. I notice they have some evidence that transmission is reduced but presumably not enough data points for statistical significance yet
 

Safranfoer

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Lol that’s so funny about going back to being filthy humans again? Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t remember so many folk going out drinking and pouring out into the streets and hugging everyone in sight? What’s that all about, it’s as if being locked down for a few months made these people insane?
The only people I’ve known who have had the Covid are my neighbors and the husband caught it on a night out with his mates in Skipton and then passed it to his wife.
Everyone I know who’s been sensible has been fine. Ive never been a touchy, feely type person anyway and can’t be doing with folk invading my personal space.
I'd be very happy never to get back to casual hugging and touching, particularly in business contexts. I love the new emphasis on constant hand washing and not being in people's faces/houses, and in all honesty wouldn't mind if the mask culture continued. I like hiding behind it, and people are mucky.
 

Andrew B

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I'd be very happy never to get back to casual hugging and touching, particularly in business contexts. I love the new emphasis on constant hand washing and not being in people's faces/houses, and in all honesty wouldn't mind if the mask culture continued. I like hiding behind it, and people are mucky.
We’ve all been in that awkward situation where a tiny bit of spittle goes fly off into someone’s face lol.
My mum who’s now retired used to work in Asda at nights on the meds n vits isle and she said some of the sights she saw would turn your stomach? Folk coming in at 3AM in pyjamas and coughing over everything when most of us know there’s nothing they give you for flu.
Same goes with the masks though, folk just seem to want to play with em and render them useless. That said I’m gonna continue to use one in my local chemist as I’m sure that’s where I picked up the flu twice.

We’ve all heard the saying about how one acts when they think nobody is looking? Well to add to the list of those making the rules and not abiding by them, themselves. A guy called Gavin Newsome in America got caught on camera at some real posh dinner table with some lobbyists and none were distancing or wearing masks?
His following apology was truly awful and not in the least sincere. There’d all be better for being honest and saying “ I messed up and got caught”.
Seeing this doesn’t change what I’m doing, but you can see why some folk get on one about it.
 

seeking

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I wouldn’t say I’m frightened of having a vaccine. What bothers me is I’ve not seen anyone talk about going back to life as it once was?
As it happens I’ve done all that’s been asked and therefore have stayed safe, but I’m not gonna live in fear as it’s not a good place to be imo.
I see the forum's very own epidemiological expert has put you right already about "Covid being far more deadly than flu, how it's definitely not combining with flu and the compulsory muzzling etc. is also stopping flu."

But I also note that the jury's still out and on the basis of all available evidence to date, that is all total guff. Especially the muzzling bit, viz:

CV19 cases Sweden vs Czech Rep.png




Still, we may be able to guess next year when the actual numbers are in.

I think your post is is spot on.

These folk do not appear to want things to return to normal.

Instead they appear hell bent on scaring everyone Christmasless witless.

I find it incredibly funny and satisfying in a way to see those perporting to be "left-liberal" and who are normally on the right-on side of things becoming almost fascistic in their mania about this subject and the very real harms being done that will be borne by the vast majority of under 70s who are still totally unaffected medically by CV19!

We'll see when the final numbers are in, next year.

Because it's novel, it would appear to be thought more dangerous than it is, or will become (this so called 2nd wave is definitely a "damp squib" in comparison with the proper one in Feb-Mar-Apr-May.) Even HMG is finding it harder to fudge the numbers to look anything like the apocalyptic predictions the nutters modellers came up with.

In reality it seems CV19 is not much of an efficient killer now. Demographically it kills, on average, folk who are above the life expectancy. Unlike flu it does not act across the ages, unlike CV19-induced austerity it won't kill the poor young folk.

So forcing the vast majority of folk to "go directly to jail" when a very small fraction of the populace, who have generally had their life expectancy, is actually at risk of death (sure, hype up long CV19, forget about long flu and the tanking social structures etc.) appears to be, well, it's BURNING DOWN THE HOUSE DOWN TO KILL A MOUSE, isn't it?


Perhaps the Lockdown proponents baying for even more restrictions have big share portfolios in Pfeizer, like some on Sage do without disclosing freely, or other companies that want to medicalise life.

Perhaps they're just gullible?






...Of course, we will pretty much get back to being filthy humans as quickly as possible. So Covid will probably be managed just like flu in future years without lockdowns and without any restrictions on personal freedoms.
Hear hear.

The nicest thing about where I am at the moment is social mingling, handshakes, hugging, laughing and joking face to face, beers and meals together. Christ, it's great to be back to normal.

Watching and hearing about the clowns spoiling Xmas in UK is galling mind...


I will be actually interested if CV19 displaces flu in the short (appears to have) or long term (jury out). Most species have ecological niches and can displace others, temporarily or whatever, perhaps novel viruses do (that was a rumour about why SARS disappeared IIRC). We will see.
 
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Rennie

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Perhaps we're supposed to live our allotted statistically expected life span, then shuffle!, that way the pension companies keep our brass, the Govt. don't have to pay health care for us old dinosaurs and the worlds population will drop to statistically acceptable level's all round.No need for the expense of another World War then, simples!.
Pedro.
 

salarchaser

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I guess the question about infected time being reduced still stands. I notice they have some evidence that transmission is reduced but presumably not enough data points for statistical significance yet
Third time I've heard it today. Rewound the article and listend to it 3 times to make sure I heard it correctly.

'Highly efficient at preventing the symptoms of covid.. . .'.

Good news, but still seems they arent stating it will prevent you catching and spreading it.
I might be reading too much into it, but the wording seems specific and consistent.
 

Andrew B

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Perhaps we're supposed to live our allotted statistically expected life span, then shuffle!, that way the pension companies keep our brass, the Govt. don't have to pay health care for us old dinosaurs and the worlds population will drop to statistically acceptable level's all round.No need for the expense of another World War then, simples!.
Pedro.
I kid you not, my family know an 80yr old bloke who lives near. He’s always been an eccentric to some, wears clogs and fine Tweed suits and he’s always been one to speak his mind. At the very start of this before any care home stuff, he said to us that he thinks it’s a way of getting rid of the old folks?
Naturally he got told to shut up, but after seeing such a global, monumental f*** up in care homes in every country? One does have to wonder if he was onto something lol.

I don’t think any of that can be disputed re care homes and yet the media and big tech have manoeuvred things to the point where anything folk say that doesn’t fit with their political beliefs or ideals are labelled as conspiracy theorists.
 

Tangled

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I kid you not, my family know an 80yr old bloke who lives near. He’s always been an eccentric to some, wears clogs and fine Tweed suits and he’s always been one to speak his mind. At the very start of this before any care home stuff, he said to us that he thinks it’s a way of getting rid of the old folks?
Naturally he got told to shut up, but after seeing such a global, monumental f*** up in care homes in every country? One does have to wonder if he was onto something lol.

I don’t think any of that can be disputed re care homes and yet the media and big tech have manoeuvred things to the point where anything folk say that doesn’t fit with their political beliefs or ideals are labelled as conspiracy theorists.
What???
 

Andrew B

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I see the forum's very own epidemiological expert has put you right already about "Covid being far more deadly than flu, how it's definitely not combining with flu and the compulsory muzzling etc. is also stopping flu."

But I also note that the jury's still out and on the basis of all available evidence to date, that is all total guff. Especially the muzzling bit, viz:

View attachment 52982



Still, we may be able to guess next year when the actual numbers are in.

I think your post is is spot on.

These folk do not appear to want things to return to normal.

Instead they appear hell bent on scaring everyone Christmasless witless.

I find it incredibly funny and satisfying in a way to see those perporting to be "left-liberal" and who are normally on the right-on side of things becoming almost fascistic in their mania about this subject and the very real harms being done that will be borne by the vast majority of under 70s who are still totally unaffected medically by CV19!

We'll see when the final numbers are in, next year.

Because it's novel, it would appear to be thought more dangerous than it is, or will become (this so called 2nd wave is definitely a "damp squib" in comparison with the proper one in Feb-Mar-Apr-May.) Even HMG is finding it harder to fudge the numbers to look anything like the apocalyptic predictions the nutters modellers came up with.

In reality it seems CV19 is not much of an efficient killer now. Demographically it kills, on average, folk who are above the life expectancy. Unlike flu it does not act across the ages, unlike CV19-induced austerity it won't kill the poor young folk.

So forcing the vast majority of folk to "go directly to jail" when a very small fraction of the populace, who have generally had their life expectancy, is actually at risk of death (sure, hype up long CV19, forget about long flu and the tanking social structures etc.) appears to be, well, it's BURNING DOWN THE HOUSE DOWN TO KILL A MOUSE, isn't it?


Perhaps the Lockdown proponents baying for even more restrictions have big share portfolios in Pfeizer, like some on Sage do without disclosing freely, or other companies that want to medicalise life.

Perhaps they're just gullible?







Hear hear.

The nicest thing about where I am at the moment is social mingling, handshakes, hugging, laughing and joking face to face, beers and meals together. Christ, it's great to be back to normal.

Watching and hearing about the clowns spoiling Xmas in UK is galling mind...


I will be actually interested if CV19 displaces flu in the short (appears to have) or long term (jury out). Most species have ecological niches and can displace others, temporarily or whatever, perhaps novel viruses do (that was a rumour about why SARS disappeared IIRC). We will see.
I have to admit that originally I truly thought that Covid 19 didn’t exist at all, which makes me cringe now.
That said having followed this from the start I’ve paid close attention to how this has been reported and how things and narratives have changed based on their own predictions of deaths?
Does anyone remember foreign news videos of folk dropping dead on the spot in the streets and bodies lying in the road? It was like the film Andromeda strain( great film) for a strain of Corona virus that we now know has a 99.997% chance of not killing you.
The narrative was where are we gonna put the dead and how will crematoriums cop.
Laws in America got passed about the usual standard for cause of death, allowing drs to call it Covid if they so wished.
In March they were saying by June we should be able to allow sports like Cricket and Football to resume but by October we expect there to be another huge spike?(so predictable).
And as you say I’ve never seen the media particularly in America being so upset at any good news.
No s*** that grey haired CNN reporter (Vanderbilt Guy) did a report the other day and it was so obvious he was reading off the auto cue, and he’s giving it the usual Orange man bad thing and then pretends to go off script and whilst wiping away supposed tears, mentions the poor little boy in bed who can’t see his mummy.

What does it all mean? Virus will always virus and no amount of politics or lockdowns is gonna make it disappear so I’ll continue to keep myself away from catching it as much as I can but it doesn’t mean I trust the whole thing.
 

Andrew B

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It was a tongue in cheek reply to a tongue in cheek reply about the elderly.
In all seriousness though we knew an old lady who had a hip operation and her family had no idea as to what was going on until she was placed in a care home and died of Covid 19.

Im no dr or scientist but placing elderly patients in care homes when they are the ones that need protection was a move that defies all logic. Care homes were being offered thousands of pounds to take new patients in.
My point is that when all of this comes to end if the vaccines do their job? Conspiracy or just ineptitude around all the care homes is the one thing that will stand out imo.
I didn’t watch it the other night, but the BBC program about them trusting the science I’m guessing would have touched on the care home thing?
 

Walleye

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"19th March the UK government announces £1.6Bn of funding for local authorities to help with the cost of adult social care and support for the homeless; and £1.3Bn to the NHS and social care, to allow up to 15,000 people to be discharged from hospital."

I suspect with hindsight the people who thought up the 2nd part wish that had never happened. The disease was already in the hospitals so discharging 15,000, the majority of which probably went into care homes, was probably not the brightest idea anyone ever had.
 
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