Covid Injection

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Handel

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Looks like we owe Jeremy Corbyn a big apology. I would put him in charge tomorrow, creating a British National Pharmaceutical Corporation tomorrow - in the same way we had a British National Oil Corporation (BNOC) in the 1770's to ensure oil supplies.

Boris Johnson has temporary humiliated the EU over vaccine supplies. He could easily have diffused this confrontation 4 weeks ago with a few emphatic words and some token return gestures - which would have ensured cooperation in the future.

I think he has deliberately fanned this fire, to justify his previous Brexit stance - tragically leaving us totally isolated in the future.

Instead the EU must now future proof itself against the UK in any battle for even basic Pharmaceuticals - some of which were already in short supply before Covid. The EU will put an embargo on exports to us in future at the first necessity - in the same way the USA has blocked any Covid vaccine exports to us.

Other than the EU, the rest of the world either hates us, despises us, or has no capability to help us.

We need a state run Pharmaceutical industry for all essentials - not grovelling for something 'just in time'.

Is this pharmaceutical company going to own its own patents - huge investment? Or is it going to be like the Serum Institute in India where it produces other companies' vaccines?
 

offshore

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Is this pharmaceutical company going to own its own patents - huge investment? Or is it going to be like the Serum Institute in India where it produces other companies' vaccines?
The Full Monty - integrated from top to bottom. Everybody else hates us now; there is nobody left.

Think of the cost of buying PPE in a boom and developing software in a rush - and then think of needing Insulin urgently . It would end up cheaper onshore and provide some proper jobs to pay a mortgage (IMO).

'And based on how its 2018/19 budget was spent, the extra direct spending on Covid-19 is broadly equivalent to the total annual spending on all outpatient, diagnostic, accident and emergency, critical care, and mental health services combined. Spending on PPE alone is similar to the total annual spend on general practice, accident and emergency, and ambulance services combined. Spending on Test and Trace is similar to the total cost of all GP prescribing'.

 

pol_angler

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Just booked both of vaccination sessions. I'm 42. The speed of the vaccine roll-out is very, very impressive.

Impressive it is. I am a bit older than you and have not been contacted yet. How did you managed to jump me???

When my time comes, I will be hoping for Moderna, Pfizer jab but AZ will also do.
 

Rrrr

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Impressive it is. I am a bit older than you and have not been contacted yet. How did you managed to jump me???

When my time comes, I will be hoping for Moderna, Pfizer jab but AZ will also do.
I think it depends how quick your local area is getting through the lists.

Sent from my SM-G981B using Tapatalk
 

Safranfoer

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Impressive it is. I am a bit older than you and have not been contacted yet. How did you managed to jump me???

When my time comes, I will be hoping for Moderna, Pfizer jab but AZ will also do.
Our vaccination centre is racing through... I had my injection at lunch today and it was incredibly well organised. Quite moving seeing all the volunteers and healthcare workers work so efficiently to help us.

My husband had his yesterday lunch and was alarmingly feverish in the night. Hot as a furnace but felt freezing cold in himself and convulsively shivering. Tried to wrap himself around me to warm up but said I was too cold - this is good as he was uncomfortably hot and I couldn’t breathe... So he had a rough night sweating and tossing and turning, but feels pretty much fine today, just mildly feverish. So I’m hoping I escape it but at least I know what to expect. I’ve preemptively spent the afternoon watching Netflix in bed with my boy - My Octopus Teacher is magnificent...

I hope you get called soon. I quite fancied Pfizer too but got AZ. Just feels good to be on my way through it. One of my good friends is really struggling to recover her fitness post-covid. I don’t have time for long term breathing problems.
 
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fixedspool

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You couldn't make this up really could you. Oh you just did.:sick:
Our vaccination centre is racing through... I had my injection at lunch today and it was incredibly well organised. Quite moving seeing all the volunteers and healthcare workers work so efficiently to help us.

My husband had his yesterday lunch and was alarmingly feverish in the night. Hot as a furnace but felt freezing cold in himself and convulsively shivering. Tried to wrap himself around me to warm up but said I was too cold - this is good as he was uncomfortably hot and I couldn’t breathe... So he had a rough night sweating and tossing and turning, but feels pretty much fine today, just mildly feverish. So I’m hoping I escape it but at least I know what to expect. I’ve preemptively spent the afternoon watching Netflix in bed with my boy - My Octopus Teacher is magnificent...

I hope you get called soon. I quite fancied Pfizer too but got AZ. Just feels good to be on my way through it. One of my good friends is really struggling to recover her fitness post-covid. I don’t have time for long term breathing problems.
 

Safranfoer

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Make WHAT up? What have I made up, fixedspool? The fact that the vaccine worked exactly as designed and triggered an immune response in my husband to ensure strong antibodies have been made to protect him in the event of a full infection?

Did I make up how vaccines work? I feel like someone should have paid me for that. Don't you get streets named after you...?

Have you ever read about the function of a fever in a human body? Do you know WHY we run a temperature when we are ill? Did I make up the fact that the raising of our core temperature allows the cellular mechanisms that create antibodies to do their thing? They advise parents of young kids not to bring down fevers with paracetamol unless they're above a certain temperature or really miserable these days, to build the immune system - just keep them cool and comfortable. Yes, my husband had a rough night. He's absolutely fine now. Busily growing antibodies. It's brilliant.
 
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ACW

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Just had my 2nd AZ Oxford jab today so far feeling fine ,they did say symptoms more likelyy this time around ,however the first one in january had no discernable downsides!
As a COPD suffferer I am well pleased.
 

Safranfoer

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fixedspool

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Well they would say that wouldn't they. Get real. As always anyone with something that does not fit the wanted narrative it gets character assassination in short shrift. What qualifications do the 'fact checkers' have? Everyone's gone jab crazy/
 

salmo76

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Fair enough Safranfoer good to see other opinions but it still gives me pause for thought ; maybe more truths will come too light as time goes on , about the disease , the tactics used to defeat it , the costs / benefits to society and where we go from here.
 
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Bonito

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Well they would say that wouldn't they. Get real. As always anyone with something that does not fit the wanted narrative it gets character assassination in short shrift. What qualifications do the 'fact checkers' have? Everyone's gone jab crazy/

Think it`s high time for you to "get real" and stop spouting your guff. Who are the fact checkers ? Well for one, the government of Gib. and secondly Reuters. Then again you will know better than them, wake up, you have been wrong all along, you are now (on here) either laughed at or ignored, apart from maybe saffy who likes to argue.

“The Gibraltar Health Authority can confirm that there is no evidence at all of any causal link between these six deaths and the inoculation with the Pfizer vaccine”, the press release said. “Statements to the contrary on social media are entirely untrue.”

According to the government, these six people appear to have caught COVID-19 before they were vaccinated.


“Despite testing for COVID-19 before vaccination, the infection had not been detected in them at the time they were vaccinated, but in the days immediately after.”

These people were all aged between 70 and 100, the government said.

Reuters fact check has debunked similar claims about COVID-19 vaccine safety
 

Safranfoer

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Think it`s high time for you to "get real" and stop spouting your guff. Who are the fact checkers ? Well for one, the government of Gib. Then again you will know better than them, wake up, you have been wrong all along, you are now (on here) either laughed at or ignored, apart from maybe saffy who likes to argue.
I don't especially like to argue. I like to debate, but it goes beyond that with fixedspool. I'll never sit quietly while he tries his bully boy tactics.
 

Safranfoer

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Fair enough Sanranfoer good to see other opinions but it still gives me pause for thought ; maybe more truths will come too light as time goes on , about the disease , the tactics used to defeat it , the costs / benefits to society and where we go from here.
Oh absolutely. We're in full on 'react' mode now, no time to plan, just react to a rapidly changing landscape. Certainly in this country, that tactics have been really crude and blunt. Not at all sophisticated - but hopefully when things calm down, we can learn for next time.

It had better be in a good few decades' time.
 

fixedspool

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I don't especially like to argue. I like to debate, but it goes beyond that with fixedspool. I'll never sit quietly while he tries his bully boy tactics.
Well you could have fooled me. You don't debate at all you just lecture, endlessly on almost any subject, post after post, day after day day after day but your stamina is impressive I have to say.
Just because I don't agree with you, you suggest I use bullyboy tactics. Not so. I merely suggest to you there might be an agenda other than the one you so fervently pursue.
As for bonito -who manage more than one sentence in his last post, he seems to think that anews agency or the Gibraltar government is the source of truth. when did any Government tell the truth especially when its own agenda might be put in question. Welcome to the real world.
 

Elibank

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Well you could have fooled me. You don't debate at all you just lecture, endlessly on almost any subject, post after post, day after day day after day but your stamina is impressive I have to say.
Just because I don't agree with you, you suggest I use bullyboy tactics. Not so. I merely suggest to you there might be an agenda other than the one you so fervently pursue.
As for bonito -who manage more than one sentence in his last post, he seems to think that anews agency or the Gibraltar government is the source of truth. when did any Government tell the truth especially when its own agenda might be put in question. Welcome to the real world.
Have you never considered that other posters might think your posts objectionable, not to say downright rude? Have you ever tried to answer Dee’s posts without either a sneer, or an oblique reference to fishwives? Please play the posts and not the posters.
 

mows

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Think it`s high time for you to "get real" and stop spouting your guff. Who are the fact checkers ? Well for one, the government of Gib. and secondly Reuters. Then again you will know better than them, wake up, you have been wrong all along, you are now (on here) either laughed at or ignored, apart from maybe saffy who likes to argue.

“The Gibraltar Health Authority can confirm that there is no evidence at all of any causal link between these six deaths and the inoculation with the Pfizer vaccine”, the press release said. “Statements to the contrary on social media are entirely untrue.”

According to the government, these six people appear to have caught COVID-19 before they were vaccinated.


“Despite testing for COVID-19 before vaccination, the infection had not been detected in them at the time they were vaccinated, but in the days immediately after.”

These people were all aged between 70 and 100, the government said.

Reuters fact check has debunked similar claims about COVID-19 vaccine safety
So did they die

" with covid"
Or
"with Pfizer vaccine"?
 

Safranfoer

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Not at ALL worried to hear that Canada have halted use of the AZ vaccine in under 55s while they scope the maybe, perhaps, could be 1 in 100,000 risk of blood clots, mostly in women. Sure it'll be fine. Have made a diary date for 20 days' time: 'Stop worrying about rare blood clot with up to 40% fatality rate'.

I'll be FURIOUS if the anti-vaxxers were right... ;-) Also, maybes dead.

(Not really that worried. Risk of clots when taking hormonal contraceptives is 1 in 1,000 and they give those out to women under 55 like sweets. NOW we're all worried about women clotting...?)
 

seeking

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By the time I post this, perhaps Auntie will realise the error of her ways and edit it, so I got a screenshot as well as proof. Original (;) and any later modifications to it) article is Here and is a BBC report about the inferred impact of vaccination in care home settings.

Righto, anyone logical with a modicum of knowledge of how science works (and more importantly, can be bastardised) will be able to tell a few things from this para (my comments in red):


"Potentially less infectious

Around 11% of care home residents in the study had already been infected with coronavirus in the past.

A single dose of either vaccine appeared to have little impact on that group, indicating those with a previous infection were already well-protected.

So why mass vaccinate young folk when a. natural immunity is always best; b. most younger folk (below 65) are unaffected by CV19?

A small proportion did catch the disease in the weeks after being given a single jab. But researchers said laboratory tests on samples from that group suggested they might be less infectious than those who had not yet received a vaccine.
So basically the jab does not prevent you getting CV19. This is already widely known and hence the jab may just be like a placebo. "....suggested they might be less infectious" is science speak for "possibly not!"

As for the hypothesis that is may be less infectious if you're jabbed, it is not equally likely (given the evidence - much lower excess deaths in 2nd vs. 1st wave - suggests the virus could have evolved normally to be more transmissible and less deadly like colds) that that would occur naturally anyway without jabbing? That that would surely put this study's conclusion in serious doubt!

"It's early data but we think that is potentially very significant, especially in a care home setting," said Dr Shallcross. And equally valid, you could substitute "potentially insignificant" and also be correct!

Although protection from a first dose in the study was described as "substantial", the research team said a second follow-up shot would still be important to increase the duration of immunity, and to maximise protection that is provided by vaccination. OK, fine, a working hypothesis requiring testing, no proof as yet either way.

The UCL research, which was funded by the Department of Health and Social Care, is part of the continuing Vivaldi study, investigating Covid-19 infections in care homes. Quelle surprise!

Prof Chris Whitty, Chief Medical Officer for England, said: "These data add to the growing evidence that vaccines are reducing Covid-19 infections and doing so in vulnerable and older populations, where it is most important that we provide as much protection from Covid as possible." As above the actual evidence is scant, and may just reflect placebo, but let's not stop the truth getting in the way of tall tales! Sage (with their BigPharma shareholders onboard) have a history of that!




Meanwhile, given the above, the anti-scientific numpties at Twitter has seen fit to censor Martin Kuldorff for stating absolute facts about the CV19 vaccine (story here), here is a copy of the eminent virologist's tweet pre-censorship:

Screen-Shot-2021-03-29-at-10.23.44-AM-1-768x633.png





PS - What happened on Gibraltar post-jab rollout should be especially concerning for all interested parties. We can of course not rule out cause-coincidence interplay, but...
 
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