Brexit

Grassy_Knollington

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Because all we don't want for xmas is fascism and hatred??? :D
Some of them really are an unpleasant bunch, but she’s spot on WRT the EU there. A bit like old Niggle Farage.

Parties like AFD will continue to rise as long as the European elite continue to stick their fingers in their ears and view any criticism of the project as Omertà.

You can get back to arguing about washing machines now :lol:
 

pol_angler

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You can get back to arguing about washing machines now :lol:
Thanks but no. I've already lost two or three fag breaks over that and I don't allow myself many of those! :D

Parties like AFD will have their place in every (almost) country but I disagree they will continue to rise. They represent people who for whatever the reason go though their lives hating other people and blaming others for their own misadvantures. They won't continue to rise and (just like Nigel) will be where's they should be - in the margins.
 

salarchaser

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I voted remain, but all I can say is 'about ****ing time'.

Though, people should remember, this is only the end of the beginning.
A long way to go yet.
 

david1982mk2

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You need a spend some time in real europe to see how rotten to the core it is. In 20 mins France is now the second biggest economy which is staring down the barrel of possibly going bankrupt by the end of the year. Mean while Germany pulls the strings to keep its self on top. Tonight is possibly the beginning of the end of the eu dream.

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Walleye

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If the EU can ever get the European population to be happy to pay taxes in their own country to be spent in another then they will succeed.
The fundamental problem is you can't have currency union without federal taxation.
You see the pressures which arise in Greece, Italy etc.
Brexit is a distraction and in itself cannot and will not cause the EU to fail.
 

JACK POWER

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"If the EU can ever get the European population to be happy to pay taxes in their own country to be spent in another then they will succeed."

That W has been going on for about 50 years. But you're right, for all its many, many faults the EU will succeed. Still the best game in town.
 

morphfly

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"If the EU can ever get the European population to be happy to pay taxes in their own country to be spent in another then they will succeed."

That W has been going on for about 50 years. But you're right, for all its many, many faults the EU will succeed. Still the best game in town.
Not too sure now that the contributing nations will be down to 2 or more likely 1.5. New members will not be contributors but recipients. That can't be sustainable.
Morphfly
 

Walleye

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"If the EU can ever get the European population to be happy to pay taxes in their own country to be spent in another then they will succeed."

That W has been going on for about 50 years. But you're right, for all its many, many faults the EU will succeed. Still the best game in town.
For a small amount of taxes and contributions, yes it has been going on for a while.
What I am talking about is where the EU collect the majority of taxes and the EU decide where those taxes are spent.
A single currency needs a high level of federal taxation where the EU can and will move money around to address imbalances caused by the inherently different economic conditions and productivity in each country.
The EU does that with bailout loans at the moment, for example, Greece's debt is still Greece's debt. In a federal system, it would be EU debt and every EU taxpayer would have paid their taxes to pay for Greece's debt. They are trying their hardest to standardise taxation rates and fiscal policy across the EU so they can move to a federal taxation system. It isn't popular across Europe, which is why they are doing it slowly bit by bit; creeping federalisation so few people really notice when it happens. The big problem they have is they need to get on with it and soon or the single currency will continue to cause more problems like Greece. A single currency without federalisation cannot succeed. I am confident in this statement because history shows single currencies or fixed exchange rate mechanisms cannot succeed.

I wouldn't agree to it being the best show in town but it is a very interesting experiment.
When you look back at the formation of the EEC, one of the main drivers was French nationalism. DeGaulle put French interests above all others and he thought he could have Germany as a junior partner contributing to French prosperity with France as the leading nation in Europe. This is why he blocked our entry - it didn't benefit France so he blocked it, twice. DeGaulle also didn't want federalisation. He wanted a strong France, leading the way and setting it's own laws and taxation.
It didn't quite work out as DeGaulle envisaged. I often wonder how the French feel after ending up a junior partner of Germany. Whoever has the money has the power.

Brexit is also an interesting experiment for the EU. They will have a strong trading nation geographically close but outside the EU. It will be interesting to see if they can overcome their protectionist tendencies and embrace global trade with a strong global trader right on their doorstep. In the long run it could be good for the outlook of the EU. I personally think they will seek to control instead of laissez-faire and miss a big opportunity.
 

highlander gus

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Chester

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Not a done deal, but I thought we would never build another car in UK.
good news for the Northeast economy if it happens.
Rumour is that Nissan want to close their unprofitable plant in Barcelona, where they assemble a pickup truck for Renault in addition to a couple of Nissan models. Confusing part is that the models that are being linked with a transfer to the UK aren’t built in Barcelona. Guess we will have to wait and see.
 

carrowmore

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This article by a London based barrister chimes with what one of my work colleagues from Northern Ireland was telling me recently.

"Slowly but inexorably any perceived advantages of British citizenship over Irish citizenship are disappearing or being neutralised for the People of Northern Ireland. Regardless of one’s political stance the worth of a burgundy Irish passport over a (soon to be) blue UK passport is beyond doubt. When it comes to living a life in the UK, the Republic of Ireland, or in other EU states, there is little point in relying on British citizenship alone and every reason to rely on Irish citizenship as well. Where a person from Northern Ireland seeks to rely on Irish citizenship alone, almost nothing is lost. The choices made by the UK government in deciding to withdraw from the EU and on what terms have consequences, including ones unintended or underplayed."

 
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