5 FOOT FASTSINK POLYLEADER.

jimmythefish

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Right chaps,what’s the next step up if your using a 5 foot fastsink polyleader, but the currents still forcing the fly up,what’s the way to go to get the fly’s deeper.
 

MCXFisher

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10 foot fast, followed by a 10 foot very fast.

The 5 footers hardly get the fly down at all, except in slower water. However, they do make a useful alternative to an intermediate tip or leader.
 

NEbody

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A heavier fly. I use 6mm tungsten tubes to give weight to relatively small flies.
If you use a light fly, you’re relying on the polyleader to pull it down (on the end of several feet of tippet). That isn’t going to happen quickly enough in a faster flow. A heavy fly will sink quickly until the pull from the line stops it.
 

Rennie

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5ft polys. in most circumstances do little other than prevent a flee skating!, or help in keeping hackled flee's off the top in a fast glide.They can be quite good at holding a flee close to the top layers though!, sometimes its about keeping the flee from going too deep as much as getting it down!.
I tend to use 5ft polys. off the end of multi tip lines or on the front end of 3D sinkers, occasionally on the Float/sink 1 Guideline heads.
Mostly however I'll use 10ft polys. off my floating lines and not only for their sinking capabilities, but as part of a balanced tapered leader construction. A poly leader or poly tip is in fact a tapered leader covered in various grades of sinking polymer, a 10ft poly and 5 to 6ft of tippet (attached via a leader ring of course!) will give you the pilot a more than acceptable tapered leader set up for most lengths of rod, aiding anchor for casting, good turn over for final presentation and control of depth-certainly in the important top layers of water.Also can be useful with small copper/tungsten tubes in average flows for getting down n dirty now n again Francis Stylee!
The longer 10ft polys will get a bit deeper and it will be at a gentler angle which leads to better hook ups.
Interestingly the longer 15ft ( or is it 14ft?) polys don't give a greater advantage over the 10ft polys as far as getting down-most of the time!-, they will present better and give a better anchor for longer rods right enough, but I've never found a significant advantage in their use - Rage lines apart!
Pedro.
 

mc andy

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You still have 2 or 3 other densitys of poly to achieve more depth, but this we fly from angling active drops like a stone! I can highly recommend it.

Weighted fly or tungsten cone head will help. I tie some dressed flys with lead or tungsten sheet to give me the option when deth is needed and use orange tying thread for the heads to identify them.

Cheers andy
 

Neil W

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10 foot fast, followed by a 10 foot very fast.

The 5 footers hardly get the fly down at all, except in slower water. However, they do make a useful alternative to an intermediate tip or leader.
This what I would do as well. I also like a Scandi VT with the intermediate head.
 

Rrrr

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Im lazy so usualy stick a cone head fly on first to see if it gets it down a bit.

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simonjh98

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If you're using a 5 foot you'll need a really short leader to get down. I recommend using the 10 foot tips instead.

It isn't really much of an issue for me as I prefer fishing just below the surface anyway during the summer months so I use mainly a 5 foot intermediate tip in normal levels, and a 5 foot slow sink in a dropping spate. I will change to a fast sink depending on the flow however

The 10 foot extra super fast sink tips work really well in the autumn for me when the water is colder so you could try one of them. Even when using shrimp flies on singles I bump off the bottom so they definitely get down plenty
 

Rennie

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Forgot to mention one very important thing, you'll only ever get so deep with any 5ft poly! and that won't be 5ft deep unless you're in a pond!.
What will happen is you may well get where ever you end up getting a tadge quicker and possibly hold that depth a bit more easily too when you switch to the faster sinking 5 ft polys..
If you've a 5ft poly and the same of tippet, I'd be surprised if you ever got more than 2ft or so down, without the use of a weighted or skinny heavy flee! any way.
The 5ft length and the draw of the current will always be limiting factors!
Pedro.
 

Hardydemon 86

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Right chaps,what’s the next step up if your using a 5 foot fastsink polyleader, but the currents still forcing the fly up,what’s the way to go to get the fly’s deeper.
If its for the cart i would use 10 ft tips i find they work the best don’t bother with 5 ft tips atall now
 

jimmythefish

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Thanks lads,really appreciate the help .
10 foot fast, followed by a 10 foot very fast.

The 5 footers hardly get the fly down at all, except in slower water. However, they do make a useful alternative to an intermediate tip or leader.
Yeah thanks buddy, put a 10 ft airflo one on last night for an early start tomorrow ?
 

Rrrr

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If you're using a 5 foot you'll need a really short leader to get down. I recommend using the 10 foot tips instead.

It isn't really much of an issue for me as I prefer fishing just below the surface anyway during the summer months so I use mainly a 5 foot intermediate tip in normal levels, and a 5 foot slow sink in a dropping spate. I will change to a fast sink depending on the flow however

The 10 foot extra super fast sink tips work really well in the autumn for me when the water is colder so you could try one of them. Even when using shrimp flies on singles I bump off the bottom so they definitely get down plenty
With a 5 foot i was shown to use a leader/tippet of no more than 3 foot in spring otherwise the fly sits above the leader. The fish dont seem to care.

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kingfisher

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Putting a heavy copper/tungsten cond head will undoubtably get you down, but will reduce the mobility unless in very turbulent water.
Generally it’s best to get down with a sinking/fast sinking tip and a note mobile fly imho
 

Speytime

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Is it possible for a weighted fly to sit above the line/tip?
I can only picture it in my mind and I can't get my head around it?
I can't picture a weighted fly sitting above the sink tip, I'm thinking equal water pressure top and bottom of the fly making the fly hang in the position of least resistance = immediately opposite the sink tip depth?

I'm also picturing a booby drawing relatively level if you give a pull.

I've read it a number of times but could never fathom it out would you mind explaining?

Thanks Al
With a 5 foot i was shown to use a leader/tippet of no more than 3 foot in spring otherwise the fly sits above the leader. The fish dont seem to care.

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Rrrr

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Is it possible for a weighted fly to sit above the line/tip?
I can only picture it in my mind and I can't get my head around it?
I can't picture a weighted fly sitting above the sink tip, I'm thinking equal water pressure top and bottom of the fly making the fly hang in the position of least resistance = immediately opposite the sink tip depth?

I'm also picturing a booby drawing relatively level if you give a pull.

I've read it a number of times but could never fathom it out would you mind explaining?

Thanks Al
Im on about a double or monkey on and ally tube etc. Our coquet spring pools arent deep and are full of snaggy rocks. If you go for something like a tungsten conehead it seems to get between the stones and snag up. Best to use something like a fast sink tip and lighter flee and it seems to fish low but dosent hang up as much. Full sunk lines and heads are banned as a throwback to the days of lead core and snatching fish.

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MCXFisher

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Is it possible for a weighted fly to sit above the line/tip?
I can only picture it in my mind and I can't get my head around it?
I can't picture a weighted fly sitting above the sink tip, I'm thinking equal water pressure top and bottom of the fly making the fly hang in the position of least resistance = immediately opposite the sink tip depth?

I'm also picturing a booby drawing relatively level if you give a pull.

I've read it a number of times but could never fathom it out would you mind explaining?

Thanks Al

Al,
The key factor is density, not water pressure, and the influence of hydrodynamic lift on the leader and fly. As the water passes the fly and leader it generates lift as a result of the force acting on the undersides of both. The faster the flow relative to the leader, the greater the lift.
A fly with a heavy cone head and little dressing is much heavier than the water it displaces (i.e. it’s more dense) so it sinks quickly. As there is little dressing it doesn’t generate much lift as the water goes past it. This type of fly will generally fish below the leader.
In contrast a fly with less weight and more dressing is less dense and generates greater lift. This causes it to fish higher in the water. If it’s attached to a leader that is more dense it may fish above the end of the leader, especially if you increase the speed by stripping, causing the fly to rise further.
 

jimmythefish

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Al,
The key factor is density, not water pressure, and the influence of hydrodynamic lift on the leader and fly. As the water passes the fly and leader it generates lift as a result of the force acting on the undersides of both. The faster the flow relative to the leader, the greater the lift.
A fly with a heavy cone head and little dressing is much heavier than the water it displaces (i.e. it’s more dense) so it sinks quickly. As there is little dressing it doesn’t generate much lift as the water goes past it. This type of fly will generally fish below the leader.
In contrast a fly with less weight and more dressing is less dense and generates greater lift. This causes it to fish higher in the water. If it’s attached to a leader that is more dense it may fish above the end of the leader, especially if you increase the speed by stripping, causing the fly to rise further.
Brilliantly explained Michael,now we all know or should know what to do,I know for sure I’ll take all that onboard and fish a fly now that has a lot less dressing, the ones I was using nearly all were sort of bushy with big long orange ? or purple tails , that would sit about 18 inches below the surface,so I’ll use less big tail flys. My mate took 17 off our river last year and fished the likes of ordinary red Francis and the likes,that’s probably why.... and also size 10 shrimp (orange with no long tails.) I guess that’s why.
 

Tangled

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A 10’ T7 to T14 polyleader, 3’ of nylon and a tungsten weighted fly Will get you down.

You have to be fast using that set-up, if you let the line sink during the cast you can't get it out again.
 

Rennie

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Being brutally honest, I wouldn't expect much at all from a 5ft poly. purely on its own, as said before keeping the flee from skating and maybe getting 1ft or so with the fastest LSR24 version.It won't offer much in the way of a good leader arrangement at all either as in my opinion it'll be too short!.
The 10ft polys. will take a bit longer to settle in the current, but will hold depth better and due to their extra length gain more depth.
The Hover is useful for keeping a flee from getting too deep!, the Inty and Green tips will both manage depth control in the top 1ft of water.Brown is pretty useful in faster deeper water.
The LSR16 and LSR 24, will both get you down!, but don't expect miracles, 3ft maybe?.
Obviously the careful choice of flee and how its weighted will be a considerable factor in this!.
The 10ft polys. will also give you that total leader length that maybe you should be looking for!, for reasons of more than depth control!.
The thing is, every river and every circumstance is different, the sink rates quoted on packaging are there as a guide and to be interpreted by you to best effect.Pretty much obvious that the faster sink rate of poly, the deeper it will get and the quicker and better it will hold its depth!
AllI can say is to try them out yourself and see what's what and how deep they'll fish on your waters.
To this day I'll rig a poly and let it all trail in the water close to me and see how deep its getting with a flee on and make a guess how its all likely to fish.
Comes a time when polys simply aren't enough, then I reach for a Multi Tip line or a dedicated full sinking head.I hasten to add I still use polys on those two!, flexibility is no bad thing in Salmon Fishing! as is a good leader arrangement (he says harping on for the umpteenth time!).
Oh!, unless I'm absolutely familiar with where I'm going to be fishing and I'm absolutely sure of the conditions, I wait untill the day of fishing and actually being on the river bank before choosing a poly to use!- might not even need one!.
And just so you know, a Fluro carbon tapered leader will sink at the same sink rate as an Intermediate poly.
Best of luck with it, oh and don't just buy one poly!, its the best investment you'll make in buying the full set of 10ft polys. in a neat little wallet, get them all rung up with leader rings and off you jolly well go!
Pedro.
 
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