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  1. #751

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    Quote Originally Posted by Safranfoer View Post
    walleye, I found this and thought youíd be interested:

    5G wireless needs fiber, and lots of it - Ciena

    I saw a tweet this morning arguing that a national fibre infrastructure is necessary for broadband AND 5G, since fibre backhauls 5G. I didnít know what this meant. So googled. I still donít fully understand, but it seems like we need the fibre regardless.
    Read this...
    Full-fibre broadband: What is it and how does it work? - BBC News

    Then this...
    UK Ranks 34th out of 207 Countries for Average Broadband Speed - ISPreview UK

    There is a series of images in the first link explaining what full fibre is.
    The vast majority of the country already has fibre to the cabinet. Over the last several years when openreach and BT have been telling you superfast broadband is coming, this is why there was an openreach van parked up at your local small green cabinet for a while doing the upgrade.
    The last part of the network which is not yet fibre and would make the network by definition "full fibre" is the link from the cabinet to your living room wall phone socket. Despite only being a short length, typically no longer than a few km, multiply that by 25 million homes in the UK and you'll see why it is such a big task and why it is to be done last of all.

    So, what Labour are talking about is upgrading everyone's connection to full fibre, replacing all the existing telephone line connections between those small green cabinets next to the road and your home. Why do that when mobile can perform the same function?

    The 2nd link gives much more information about the world rankings for wired speed. It also discusses the reasons why many people in the UK, despite having access to much faster superfast broadband than they already receive, choose not to upgrade, which also reduces the national average somewhat.

    To answer your question, of course mobile telecomms uses the existing wired network. Mobile masts are connected directly into the exchanges you see in those diagrams in the first link. Exchange to exchange is the national wired infrastructure which has been full fibre for a long time and has been used by mobile networks for a long time. When you read about the massive investments required to move from say 3G to 4G or 4G to 5G, much of the upgrade is in the technology used in the existing fibre national network to enable the greater bandwidth required when higher speed is enabled. Not so much the fibre itself but the equipment connected to each end of the fibre which sends and receives at much higher speeds.

    Note also the last few sentences of the BBC link with reference to 5G speeds.

    I have listened carefully to what the labour leadership have said on all this and in part they are deliberately misleading and fiddling what full fibre really is and in part they just haven't got a clue what it is they are talking about.
    They want to buy up the entire national infrastructure just at the point where the massive extra investment to take every home full fibre may be completely wasted because 5G and 6G are on their way.

    Free betamax for the masses. Where has socialism gone wrong?!

  2. #752
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Location
    Mid Wales
    Posts
    799

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    Absolutely hit the nail on the head. Labour don't seem to know what they are promising or why or even if people want it or need it. Imagine the huge server infrastructure that needs to be built to facilitate all these new connections or are they just going to share out the bandwidth that we have now with all the new people, if so just how slow will it be.
    Worst of all the Labour party, yes Corbyn and his bunch of no hopers will be in charge of it.

    It wouldn't be such a disaster if they kept some connections open and made them available to people who don't mind paying for a proper connection. I bit like how they implemented the two tier NHS in 1945.

  3. #753
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Yorkshire (were there a god it'd be god's own country) & Afrique
    Posts
    3,918

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    Certainly Chinese 5G will help control the masses and allow the corporates bigger marketing tentacles that folk find it ever harder to circumvent.

    READ THIS; BUY THAT; DON'T THINK; SHUT UP!

    Luckily we're about at the tipping point for the climate, so that's ok...

    Is there any evidence that Labour's fence-sitting WRT Brexit is having any effect yet? I note that Mr Burgon was not averse to a reverse double-ferret when grilled yesterday. Utterly shambolic, how can a once proud party claim this is a good move?



    And for the record:

    Quote Originally Posted by Safranfoer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seeking View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Safranfoer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seeking View Post
    ...The type of folk that brought you Zyklon B are actively encouraged by EU regs to make it worse for all of us, whether that's huge monocultures that need humungous dosings of biocidal agents just so CAP works best (for the EU Fat-Cats etc.) and keeps the vegetarians and vegans happy.


    The biosphere less so.
    seeking that's a really distasteful thing to say.
    IY(?H)O perhaps. But again, shooting off a quick post isn't always advisable.

    If you were to look into the issue a little, and re-read the post in the cold light of day, I suspect you would probably understand better. Zyklon-B (as was it's precursor) was developed as a biocide (actually a pesticide), by white-coated chemists with (presumably) good intentions but no thought for unintended consequences. The company that developed it and it's successors and share holders did well under a really warped political regime.

    Chemical companies are inexorably linked to war, wanton destruction and environmental damage. Fact of life. The shareholding and tentacles of many of these companies (e.g. BASF, Degussa, IG Farben, Beyer) are fascinating to study.*

    The white-coats with supposedly good intentions and little thought for unintended consequences are still there doing what they do. In supporting synchems, modern capitalism and marketing are doing exactly the same.


    Please don't act offended, it's unbecoming IMHO...


    What I think mows was saying is now that Monsanto (neonic specialist) is owned by Beyer (Humungous German Synchem Multinational with "dodgy" history) perhaps the EU (funded mainly by Germany, especially in the very near future) will think again about it's stance on certain synchems and so-called "environmental protections". He's just saying. I think he has a point...


    *of course Brit ones are equally fascinating, but we were talking Cyclones
    !
    seeking, I understand Zyklon B. Only because I just watched the BBC 6 part Auschwitz documentary again with my boy, to help with his homework. It was originally used as a pesticide in the camp laundry. A camp attendant observed the masks required when water was added and wondered if it would solve the problem they had with lining up people in front of huge pits and shooting them. It was inefficient and the nazis doing it were developing mental health problems.

    Iím not acting offended. Referring to Germans as the folks that brought you zyklon b just because we are talking pesticides isnít an innocent comment.
    Again, IY(?H)O perhaps...

    But IMHO there's no need to make things up or bend my words perversely.

    I didn't mention Germans originally*, and clearly the issue is with "the type of folk who brought you..." (i.e. White-Coated Scientists), unintended consequences and political interference or muddled environmental controls (hence the EU stance), whether you like it or not.

    Not sure where you're going, but Carry on, mind...





    * and any naming and shaming of German companies was balanced with the statement that Brit companies were similar...
    "...hooking mortality is higher than you'd expect: further evidence that as a numbers game, catch-and-release fishing isn't always as straightforward as it seems"
    John Gierach


    Fed up of debating C&R - see Hidden Content

    Unless otherwise stated, data used in any graph/figure/table are Crown copyright, used with the permission of MSS and/or EA and/or ICES. MSS / EA / ICES are not responsible for interpretation of these data by third parties

  4. #754

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wee Porters View Post
    Simple, aye?

    I must be thick!

    This is how it reads to me, say we have 200k nurses now, with better pay/incentives the government manage to keep the 19k nurses that would leave in those 5 years and during that time employ an additional 31k new nurses. That would mean we have 231k nurses working in the UK.

    I always thought 200 + 50 was 250, but I was wrong as it's now 231.

    That's how simple it is.


    I'll try again just for kicks.

    Every year many new nurses are recruited and many leave. The workforce remains constant if the numbers recruited and the numbers leaving remain the same. If more are recruited than leave the workforce increases. You can do this by recruiting more of loosing less, or, as in this case both. Mathematically it doesn't matter which but in practice the fewer you loose the better. If the Tory's are elected they promise to recruit 50,000 more than will leave over 5 years, thus increasing the workforce by 50,000.

    Judging by some of the responses on this thread I really do think the government needs to radically improve the teaching of basic mathematics.

  5. #755

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    Quote Originally Posted by Loxie View Post
    I'll try again just for kicks.

    Every year many new nurses are recruited and many leave. The workforce remains constant if the numbers recruited and the numbers leaving remain the same. If more are recruited than leave the workforce increases. You can do this by recruiting more of loosing less, or, as in this case both. Mathematically it doesn't matter which but in practice the fewer you loose the better. If the Tory's are elected they promise to recruit 50,000 more than will leave over 5 years, thus increasing the workforce by 50,000.

    Judging by some of the responses on this thread I really do think the government needs to radically improve the teaching of basic mathematics.
    ...or could be Bozo is just lying, which is his default position?

  6. #756

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    Could also increase the workforce by increasing the retirement age (again). Force people to work longer and more by taking away social security and shrinking the welfare state. Wouldnít that just be super?

  7. #757

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Keane View Post
    ...or could be Bozo is just lying, which is his default position?
    Seems its JCs as well as he says he watches the Queens speech on Christmas day morning.

    Sent from my SM-J330FN using Tapatalk
    Last edited by bassfly; 05-12-2019 at 09:43 AM.

  8. #758

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Keane View Post
    ...or could be Bozo is just lying, which is his default position?


    Bozo telling lies? Surely not. He is not a liar he's just a very naughty boy.







    The link below to a Website owned and run by Peter Oborne. It cobbles together an interesting mural of some of Bozo's finest whoppers



    The lies, falsehoods and misrepresentations of Boris Johnson and his government.
    Last edited by Perrypokemon; 05-12-2019 at 09:37 AM.
    It's all very well using WW2 analogies when referring to Brexit - 'spirit of the blitz' and all that. Imagine the curious atmosphere though if you were sitting in your air raid shelter looking around and realising that half of the people around you had voted to get bombed

  9. #759
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Wild west of Wales
    Posts
    231

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    Quote Originally Posted by bassfly View Post
    Seems it JCs as well as he says he watches the Queens speech on Christmas day morning.

    Sent from my SM-J330FN using Tapatalk
    Apparently 90% of the British population do the same..

  10. #760

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    Fat posh straw haired buffoon has a laugh with a few of his mates about fat orange buffoon at NATO summit. Large Dump spits his dummy and takes his ball home and ensures there wonít any post Brexshit goodies from the good olí USA.

    Who said P.G. Wodehouse is dead?

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