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  1. #31

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    [QUOTE=seeking;1003851]In your view perhaps. However, I can't get past the first graph, which compares apples and oranges and states:



    That is just not true.

    It they said, as scientists should, "proxy guestimates of CO2 concentrations based on wildly speculative methods when compared to real life measurements from the actual atmosphere of today, appear to indicate that CO2 may be higher now than in previous centuries, but there is still a very poor correlation between temperature and CO2 in these proxy guesstimates" it would be given a bit more credence.

    GIGO, just like an ICES PFA Guesstimate, based on guesstimates [/QUOTE

    Have to say this made me chuckle. So thanks for that.

    Questioning NASA data and integrity? Bit of a recurring theme this isn't it. I wonder who we should take notice of ? An organisation responsible for putting the first man on the moon or someone without any qualifications or experience in the subject that he or she is challenging- again. Difficult choice that.

    I wil just say that I believe that climate change is happening, I believe it presents a serious threat to the resources on which we all depend, and most importantly, it has almost certainly played a role in the decline of salmon either directly or indirectly. Only a complete idiot would ignore the warning signs. Trump is most dangerous individual on the planet for refusing to accept the overwhelming evidence.

    The observed loss in extent of the Greenlandic ice sheet surely provides irrefutable visual evidence that the atmosphere is warming at an alarming rate.

    Just my view though....

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Aberdeen
    Posts
    5,078

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    [QUOTE=Hardy rod;1003922]
    Quote Originally Posted by seeking View Post
    In your view perhaps. However, I can't get past the first graph, which compares apples and oranges and states:



    That is just not true.

    It they said, as scientists should, "proxy guestimates of CO2 concentrations based on wildly speculative methods when compared to real life measurements from the actual atmosphere of today, appear to indicate that CO2 may be higher now than in previous centuries, but there is still a very poor correlation between temperature and CO2 in these proxy guesstimates" it would be given a bit more credence.

    GIGO, just like an ICES PFA Guesstimate, based on guesstimates [/QUOTE

    Have to say this made me chuckle. So thanks for that.

    Questioning NASA data and integrity? Bit of a recurring theme this isn't it. I wonder who we should take notice of ? An organisation responsible for putting the first man on the moon or someone without any qualifications or experience in the subject that he or she is challenging- again. Difficult choice that.

    I wil just say that I believe that climate change is happening, I believe it presents a serious threat to the resources on which we all depend, and most importantly, it has almost certainly played a role in the decline of salmon either directly or indirectly. Only a complete idiot would ignore the warning signs. Trump is most dangerous individual on the planet for refusing to accept the overwhelming evidence.

    The observed loss in extent of the Greenlandic ice sheet surely provides irrefutable visual evidence that the atmosphere is warming at an alarming rate.

    Just my view though....

    Another recurring theme.

    He/she has just totally dismissed a raft of Norwegian fisheries scientists as being wrong in another thread.

    It must take some amount of ego to do this. I'm wondering if there might be a case of NPD going on here?

    I just keep reading more and more posts where he/she rubbishes everyone else's opinions, from layman to experts in their field. Are we in the presence of the New Messiah?

    Sadly, it's turning me off the SFF. I foresee a time when the only person he/she will have to argue with on here is themself.

    Ultimately, this ego is just getting very boring.

    Please can we bring back some posts with some fun and personality involved.....well ones that don't get stamped on by the above and 'it's' cronies at least!
    ..........so many flies, so little time!

  3. #33

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    So much i would like to say but dare not, admin may step in and close the thread,Dont look for or expect fun as it does not go down well as you know Westie.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Aberdeen
    Posts
    5,078

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    Quote Originally Posted by SOS View Post
    So much i would like to say but dare not, admin may step in and close the thread,Dont look for or expect fun as it does not go down well as you know Westie.
    Aye, SOS. Have said as much as I dare these days.

    We run of the mill salmon fishers are very much sidelined these days imho.
    ..........so many flies, so little time!

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Yorkshire (were there a god it'd be god's own country)
    Posts
    2,916

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardy rod View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by seeking View Post
    In your view perhaps. However, I can't get past the first graph, which compares apples and oranges and states:



    That is just not true.

    It they said, as scientists should, "proxy guestimates of CO2 concentrations based on wildly speculative methods when compared to real life measurements from the actual atmosphere of today, appear to indicate that CO2 may be higher now than in previous centuries, but there is still a very poor correlation between temperature and CO2 in these proxy guesstimates" it would be given a bit more credence.

    GIGO, just like an ICES PFA Guesstimate, based on guesstimates
    Have to say this made me chuckle. So thanks for that.

    Questioning NASA data and integrity? Bit of a recurring theme this isn't it. I wonder who we should take notice of ? An organisation responsible for putting the first man on the moon or someone without any qualifications or experience in the subject that he or she is challenging- again. Difficult choice that.

    I wil just say that I believe that climate change is happening, I believe it presents a serious threat to the resources on which we all depend, and most importantly, it has almost certainly played a role in the decline of salmon either directly or indirectly. Only a complete idiot would ignore the warning signs. Trump is most dangerous individual on the planet for refusing to accept the overwhelming evidence.

    The observed loss in extent of the Greenlandic ice sheet surely provides irrefutable visual evidence that the atmosphere is warming at an alarming rate.

    Just my view though....
    No worries. It's a marketing thing, they have to market it by making specious false claims. Please read my post #15, above the one you've quoted, and you'll see I fully endorse climate change and some of the issues, but the big question is whether this is due to "Anthropogenic Global Warming (AGW)" or just natural variability. Complex thing, climate. No problem with climate change happening. It certainly affects salmon and their distribution.

    The point I was making in the post you quote is that the quote from NASA is 100% wrong. There are no comparable data to compare the atmosphere of today with the atmosphere of centuries and millenia ago like the NASA graph states. Complex issue, but basically the past estimates are based on proxies based on trapped gasses (which may not actually be good proxies and are not evidence of past atmospheric gas concentrations due to differential partitioning and differences in density - basic science) not actual measurements of the atmosphere.

    Have you read Summerhaye's book? If so you will understand what I'm getting at.

    Regards
    Last edited by seeking; 14-09-2017 at 07:50 AM.
    "...hooking mortality is higher than you'd expect: further evidence that as a numbers game, catch-and-release fishing isn't always as straightforward as it seems"
    John Gierach


    Fed up of debating C&R - see Hidden Content

    Unless otherwise stated, data used in any graph/figure/table are Crown copyright, used with the permission of MSS and/or EA and/or ICES. MSS / EA / ICES are not responsible for interpretation of these data by third parties

  6. #36

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    John Mcenroe And you cant be serious man comes to mind .

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    100

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    This is turning into a "I know more than you" and" I am right" thread so I am closing it now.

    But take note to all concerned.

    It doesn't go anywhere when we cant discuss without having little digs at each other which only gets personal and discussion and the point of the thread is lost.

    Come on lads we all have disagreements and we all want to enjoy the forum in peace and give our views freely without any fear of reprocussions .

    So I am asking all to take a bit of consideration for other members and keep any personal feelings off the forum and its posts before we have to take any action which is our last resort and not one we enjoy,but if the case requires it for the peace of the forum and other members enjoyment of it, then so be it.
    Best regards

    Admin Team

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